In closing I'd note that the MoveOn ad was...distracting, but that the only Presidential candidate who seems to have shown anything resembling a spine in that matter was Senator Clinton. After 15 years as the bete noir of the right wing attack machine she seems uniquely experienced to withstand the polemical ferocity & gutter duplicity of the electoral cycle ahead

-- DanJoaquinOz

Think about how diametrical what you just wrote there is. First you yourself say that the MoveOn ad was distracting.

No, the bullshit response to it was distracting, not the ad.

Then you say that Hilary Clinton showed spine because she gets the fact that the right-wing sound machine and the Republican Party are a bunch of squealing phonies who know how to distract, but that's only true if their targets allow themselves to be played for fools. You allowed yourself to be played for a fool. That is clear in that you posted exactly what they hoped you would post. "The MoveOn ad was...distracting".

For daring to utter the (gasp!) word "distracting" you suggest that I've allowed myself "to be played for a fool" & "posted exactly what they hoped you would post." Hyperbolic, much?

-- DanJoaquinOz

No, my post about your post was not the least bit hyperbolic. Your sentence, ..."daring to utter (gasp)", was hyperbolic if not just plain nonsense, and it certainly had nothing to do with what I posted to you.

You've made a big deal out of the title of the Moveon post. You're trying to blame that on move on rather than on yourself for falling for the same old predictable shit that the noise machiine pulls every time. You're telling yourself that if Moveon hadn't used that title, then not only would the totally predictable noise machine had not had something with which to clutch their hankies about, and which to 'distract' with, then the ad would have been read and discussed for its content. Neither of those assumptions are true. If the ad didn't have the title it most likely would have been discussed very little if at all. If the ad hadn't had its title the noise machine would have found something else to clutch hankies about.

So, your post in reply to mine just shows to me all the more that you're allowing yourself to be lead and fooled by way the right wing noise machine chooses to frame the debate.

Let's review Kitt:

You accused him of

1) [being] played for a fool

2) falling for the same old predictable shit

3) allowing [him]self to be lead and fooled

And you put words in his mouth:

1)You're telling yourself that if Moveon hadn't used that title, then [...] the ad would have been read and discussed for its content.

To recap:

You insulted the man 3 times by calling him a fool in 3 different ways. In between, you misrepresented what he said in his letters. This type of rebuttal is contempt-worthy, and it is an established pattern of behavior with you, on this letters page.

Is that sufficiently concise?

-- Holly McLachlan

I told the truth how I see it. And I don't agree with your recap from after you post #3 on down from there. Concise enough for you?

But speaking of "contempt worthy" and "putting words in mouth", how about you just speak for yourself on that one. You know, rather than 'put words in the mouths of everyone' "on this letters page".

I meant your 'review' after #3.

I know you and the other MoveOn critics wouldn't want to miss this program.

At 9 pm ET on Saturday, Fox News will air a one hour special about the top commander in Iraq, Gen. David Petraeus, who recently argued in Congressional testimony that President Bush's "surge" in Iraq is working. The program, titled "American Commander: Gen. David Petraeus" and hosted by Jon Scott, will look at Petraeus' "life and times."

"It's bound to be "fair and balanced," right?"

--Steve Benen

http://www.firedoglake.com/

My idea for what to do with those folks who think that all Democrats are scum, too weak to do anything, or Republicans in drag, and would rather give their money to Wal*Mart than to the DNC, or think that either Ron Paul or Ralph Nader would make a swell president is to sentence them to spend a day reading FireDogLake.

Go ahead, tell Jane Hamsher or Christy Martin Smith that they don't have any fight left in them. (Or hell, Digby either, for that matter.)

-- William Timberman

That's Christy Hardin Smith to you bubba. And lets not leave out Looseheadprop. She's doing the happy dance as we speak.

Course, my favorite is still Miss Jane. I think that's mostly because of her life enhancing smile. She lights me up.

The left defeated Joe Lieberman in the 2006 primary and were defeated by him in the general. To me that indicates that the country will not vote for an agenda put forward by the base of the Democratic party.

Robert Abbott

Gilbert, AZ

-- ModerateDem

You are either an idiot or a damned liar. The Connecticut Republicans voted in Joe, not "the country'.

I think drlimerick has it right: without her Milk/Moscone moment she would never have been elected to local or state wide office here in California.

-- Sole Proprietor

Yep. I remember it well. It defines her. I wish I could figure out how to spend just one day of my life that would give me free reign to do anything I want from there on out and get away with it with flying colors. What a sham is the "Stupid Girl" Feinstein.