If I read Glenn right, we might as well just all sit back and wait for the fireworks to start. Democracy is dead and King George can do pretty much whatever he wants, so get out the K-Y jelly and give up. The whole country is going to listen raptly -- or numbly -- while L'il George struts his go-to-war stuff. What works in front of one of his hand-picked military audiences is going to work on everyone, the lessons of Iraq utterly unlearned. From somewhere, we're going to raise a new army equipped with new machinery, to invade a country three times as large and three times as populous as Iraq. Or maybe we'll just bomb them into the Stone Age; Americans will sit glued to their sets as we reduce a rich and ancient culture to rubble. Heck, some of my neighbors here in the San Fernando Valley, a whole shitload of whom are Iranian immigrants, could come over to watch with me on my plasma.

As much as Bush would like to start this -- not, in his case, in the name of "regime change" but because being a jumped-up "war president" doll has been the only moving part of his presidency that can be said to have succeeded -- and as much as Lieberman and AIPAC and puny little Max Boot would like it to start -- I cannot believe the American people will let it happen, or that the American military establishment will send its worn-out troops and materiel to invade yet another country. Such a degree of silence and complaisance on the part of the American people just doesn't seem possible. Nor does it seem likely the rest of the world will sit by and shake its head, content only to say, "There go those crazy Yanks again..!"

Am I whistling past the graveyard, here?

But I'm one the fence, here. This whole story is based on an arrest report written by a cop whom I have not met nor seen on TV nor been given any way to assess his integrity, his absolute and utter inability to fabricate an event in order to get his bored ass up off a toilet seat and get another scalp on his work record. I just don't know. Rogers said he had talked to people who actually had gay sex with Craig. Until at least one of those people comes forward and is shown to be a reliable source of information, I think it's just plumb un-American to convict this guy the way he's been convicted here and everywhere else. Do unto others, folks. All they've got is the word of one anonymous police officer. Would you want to lose everything on those grounds?

Give me a little credit. He pled guilty to disorderly conduct in hopes that would squelch any further foofaraw. Disorderly conduct. I can imagine (IMAGINE) doing something like that in a panic. Unlike many senators, he's not a lawyer. I'm not saying I believe him; I'm not saying I don't believe him. I'm only saying that I don't have enough information to "convict" him of being a bathroom-trolling homosexual. Which in his case, given his job and his voting record, is a very serious matter.

There are at least two other witnesses who have alleged that Craig had sex with them in public places.

Has any of those witnesses come forward and presented their statement and allowed their own credibility to be examined? Jesus, this is such a kangaroo court -- and Salon is the last place I'd expect to find a kangaroo court!

I assume he's innocent because he pled guilty to a crime he's not being convicted of in the press and right here. I do not assume he's innocent, as I've been at pains to say as clearly as I am able. I just think he's been "assumed" guilty on evidence that, under normal circumstances -- i.e. if it was being leveled at YOU -- you would want examined far more closely than it has been.

Okay, that came off a little self-contradictory. I assume he's innocent of gay cruising because he didn't plead to that and it hasn't been proven. It's my job as an American to assume he's innocent until it's PROVEN otherwise. But my original post merely said I'm on the fence. Geez, y'all are putting words in my mouth!

No one's ever heard of a case where an overzealous, misguided police officer fabricated evidence to make a collar? Never happen. Not in the good old U.S. of A. When cops write it down, we just go along with it, no need to cross-examine, Your Honor, because there is absolutely no historical evidence of a cop EVER doing that.

Of disturbing the peace. Nothing more. You guys are blowing my mind. Can you not put yourself in his shoes? Would you want to lose everything you've worked for without a trial for the crime you're losing everything FOR??

This particular thread, posted under an article about Craig, is about Craig. And nothing else. There are other threads under other items in War Room, most if not all having nothing to do with Sen. Craig.

That's what he pled to, fer Chrissakes! He's by definition guilty of it. My point is that he didn't plead guilty to soliciting gay sex yet that's what he's being "convicted" of here and everywhere else!

Yikes!