While looking up quotes on Joseph Goebbels, I came across this one: "One of the most ridiculous aspects of democracy will always remain...the fact that it has offered to its mortal enemies the means by which to destroy it."

An interesting indictment of 'democracy'.

Yes, democracy has never stood in the way of those trying to destroy it. Not really. The idea of 'democracy' appears to involve the people's ability to govern themselves. It's about 'choice'. In that way, perhaps, democracy is a lot like faith in God. You can, despite the ranting of the fundies, choose to not believe in a 'God'. Choose to not be a mono-theist. You can choose to warship the flying spaghetti monster.

The idea of a forced democracy begs the question then of who rescues the people from their current saviour.

Forcing religion on people works well to drive people away from religion. Forcing 'democracy' on people does the same when that 'democracy' is built of the stuff of the Bush league 'democracy'.

It's odd that my mind would stumble upon a religious construct for democracy... We have the ability of choice. Well, at least currently. What we do with that choice affects our array of choices in the future. Vote for a fascist state and we lose the ability to make a wide variety of choices. Vote for more of a democracy and our choices get broader, our lives become richer by the ability to choose.

Taking away choice seems to be the way of the Bushies. Taking away OUR choices. But they (the Bushies and the Pelosi's) also limit their own choices too and many have not discovered that yet. When the sleeper has awoken, there will be hell to pay. Hopefully...

Other interesting quotes that have parallels to our current times.

"What does Christianity mean today? National Socialism is a religion. All we lack is a religious genius capable of uprooting outmoded religious practices and putting new ones in their place. We lack traditions and ritual. One day soon National Socialism will be the religion of all Germans. My Party is my church, and I believe I serve the Lord best if I do his will, and liberate my oppressed people from the fetters of slavery. That is my gospel."

"We have a feeling that Germany has been transformed into a great house of God, including all classes, professions and creeds, where the Führer as our mediator stood before the throne of the Almighty."

On Goebbels: "He was clever, fanatic; having a clubfoot he might have suffered a minority inferiority complex, knowing that because of his physical appearance, he knew he never could reach leadership. He was unscrupulous in his propaganda. I always opposed Goebbels. I always tried to have people educated on a broad basis, while Goebbels tried to supply them with knowledge for the moment. Goebbels considered humans as objects to be used for political purposes - for the moment."

Damned spell checker is a fascist...

warship = worship. *sigh*

Precisely!

Precisely. Obviously, on days like today, when a significant and repulsive defeat appears imminent and inevitable, the pessimism level is higher, and when there are incremental victories, the optimism level is higher, but in general, my view is exactly what you just described.

If you end up in the same spot, isn't it better to have at least fought to stay out of it than to discover you are there and have had no say?

Well, but having a say involves action and making your opinion known.

I was always struck at the cowardice of the Reagan and Nixonian right wing and their saying 'better dead than red'. Death is permanent. Fascism is a choice. Such fatalism should be an embarrassment, not a virtue.

He was a good guy and that's actually a liability when dealing with the Bush administration...

They exploit 'loyalty' and then use it to stab you in the back.

Timmah was a tool. He was used and abused and sucked up and abused by the Bush administration. He was a willing accomplice of the crimes that happened. Every time he let his 'nice guy' influence his questioning or cause him to hold his punches he cut into the body of 'journalism' Every time any of the nations 'journalists' did it, they cut into the body of journalism.

Journalism is nearly dead. Timmah died first but he helped kill journalism.

He will be missed but from what I can tell he's not missed for being a hard and effective journalist. He's missed for being a 'good guy'.

Politics is dog eat dog. In journalism there should be no room for 'good guys' standing on the sidelines cheering for one side or the other... The nation needs, correct that, the nation DESERVES better out of the people tasked with exposing the wrongs done in politics.

Maybe we can get out of 'patty cake' journalism and start getting some stuff done... Well, I am an optimist...