Isn't that what this post of Glenn's is basically about? Holding the guy accountable for his actions?

To be honest, no. I don't think Glenn is contributing to holding Obama (or Bush or anyone else) accountable. Nor should he be in that biz. We need institutions for that. If we rely on Glenn (as opposed to Congress, or SCOTUS, or the Attorney General) to hold Obama accountable, then we're in more trouble than I thought.

I view Glenn's role as educational. Explain the legislation under consideration, point out hypocrisy, etc. I don't have time for it, but Glenn does, and I really appreciate his efforts because otherwise the information would be very difficult to obtain.

Is what Hamsher has been doing what you'd call "ranting?

No. I accused Titonwan of ranting. Ranting is calling people names and not offering any constructive criticism, or making any arguments. That's what Titonwan did. I never accused Glenn or Hamsher of ranting.

A primary candidate running against Obama is not such a wildly out of the question route for us to take. Because, as I said, Obama is building a track record, and some of it is undeniably awful.

I agree with this in the abstract, but this approach has been tried and the results are not promising. Kucinich gets what, 2% of the primary vote? Every year? He's the Dem I supported in the primary, and he's a joke. There hasn't been a serious progressive threat in the Dem party since perhaps Jesse Jackson in '84. He put a good scare into the party leadership, who did everything within their power to scuttle his run.

These guys always fizzle out. And for good reason - the deck is seriously stacked against them, and the establishment does not want them to win. Winning is HARD. So hard it's impossible, unless society really starts to fall apart completely.

At least Kucinich was able to participate in debates and get on ballots. That's more than can be said for Nader, who, based on the Dem party reaction to him, must think he's even worse than the Repubs. If any 3rd party does manage to jump the existing hurdles to ballot access, debate and public financing threshholds, the D's and R's will simply raise them again to protect their turf.

I don't know and don't need to know just yet who could run well against Obama. It probably should be someone who all ready has a record, such as Feingold. But it could also be someone we have yet to hear from. I know that a Senate run is not the same level as a presidential run but still, Lamont did well against an entrenched incumbent, the horrid Lieberman. If Lamont would have had a bit more staytoitiveness he might have won. So it might be that someone who, at this time, is not a household name could come along and then do well against Obama in a primary and then win the general.

Well, Feingold would be a great choice, and because of that wouldn't stand a chance.

The Lamont case is instructive. I don't know what you mean by stay-to-it-ive-ness - from what I've seen he ran a spirited campaign. He even won the primary!

But then his own party abandoned him - Obama and other senior party officials came out against Lamont and supported the hideous Lieberman. That is what real progressive candidates face. They might be able to pick up some house seats and a senate seat or two when conditions are right, or if they are from the right location, but the establishment will always fight tooth and nail to limit progressive influence.

I will tell you what I shall do, my fine feathered friend. I will recede back into the woods and let you monkeys sort it out like I have for the last thirty years. But I will be angry at myself for trusting again. I will be vengeful enough to spread my influence amongst my brothers and sisters. I will go back to what I do until things change and if it's for the worst, I can gladly endure that too-- and far better than most. My life has been fraught with excitement, danger and suffering and I can take the worst this government can dish out. They trained my ass. I'm with Jebbie in this scum has lied with forked tongue and with adnoto to burn this motherfuckin' house down and start new if we're to be totally ignored. Us that got him there. It's a two way street or it's one way home.

LOL - yep, looks like you've got is all figured out.