I don't mean to appear dumb or defensive for Obama's position (and I agree with everything Glenn's been saying), but is there any chance that the parts of the FISA bill that violate the 4th amendment can be struck down at a later time by the courts?

I'm just curious. I mean if the Dems were somehow able to succeed in getting the telecom immunity removed, and then depended on SCOTUS to knock down the unconstitutional parts, we would effectively win.

-- ArthGuinness

Overturned by THIS court? About the same chance as you have for winning the Powerball.

The Dems sold us out and Olbermann is doing his Sgt Schultz impression ("I see nossing -NOSSING!") because he wants Obama to win. GG has it right: When Bush advocated this bill it was fascism. When Obama votes for it, it's OK. I say that's horse shit.

Pick several of the Democratic war whores and make an example of them. Primary their sorry asses. If that means a Republitard wins the district, so be it -they were going to vote the same anyway.

You'll notice that members of Congress won't dare to cross the Gun Lobby and the Israel Lobby. Why? Because those groups won't hesitate to drop a ton of bricks on anyone who rubs them the wrong way.

Until people who oppose the police state and the Iraq War do likewise, the New Republic-ANs are what you're going to get.

An ethical government official would recuse herself from any votes (or haggling for votes) that have to do with their own financial holdings. But as you can see…

William of Ockham’s famous razor has corroded from its lack of use by the media who, as Orwell said (paraphrasing), have to go to great lengths to see what is plain as day right in front of them. A perfect example is all the contortions the media whores go through to explain why Nancy Pelosi decided to back the telecom amnesty bill. For those who really want to know, here you go (as usual, the boldface is my doing):

SF GATE (June 26, 2004)

Pelosi, who is married to investor Paul Pelosi, has amassed a large portfolio of jointly owned real estate, including three properties in the Napa Valley. They sold an 8-acre vineyard on Skellenger Lane in Rutherford last year for $1 million to $5 million, according to her disclosure form.

Paul Pelosi’s holdings include a four-story commercial building on Belden Place in San Francisco, a retail and office building on Sir Francis Drake Boulevard in San Anselmo and an ownership stake in the Auberge du Soleil resort in Napa Valley valued at $1 million to $5 million. He also has millions of dollars of shares in publicly traded companies such as Microsoft, Amazon. com and AT&T.<,blockquote>

They've always been fifth columnists for the Right. Back in the 1980s they were always supporting the death squads in Central America and added insult to injury by claiming the murder of nuns is a "liberal" position. The New Republic-AN licks its chops at any opportunity to egg on the murder of brown people, or to smear and harass those who might not want to join in.

This goes beyond the New Republic-AN. The MSM goes out of its way to promote these shysters, even though they are (a) wrong and (b) work for a magazine with a puny readership. The Nation. has MUCH bigger circulation and actually gets it right when it comes to political issues. But aside from Katrina Vanden Heuvel, how many of writers from The Nation. are regulars on news/talk shows? How about Mother Jones? Harpers?

The New Republic-AN is an open sewer of sadism, bigotry and dishonesty, yet news and opinion shows can't wait to plunge right in.

Here's an idea:

Morgan Tsvangirai just threw in the towel in the elections in Zimbabwe after his supporters were murdered, tortured etc by Mugabe's thugs. Since he's available, and political opposition is now one of those jobs homegrown Americans think is beneath them, why don't we just import him? We need political opposition that doesn't scare easily, and Tsvangirai needs a job and a new home.

Sounds more plausible than waiting for the Democowards to grow a pair.

Just click my name or go here: http://daltonator.net/durandal/blog/

The most pathetic bit in that article had to be this part:

Pelosi had another reason for backing the compromise: unlike some on the left, she actually believes domestic surveillance laws needs updating in light of the new terror threats. “We can’t go without a bill,” she said on the House floor Friday, “That’s simply just not an option.” Existing U.S. surveillance law, passed in 1978, needs to be improved, she believes, not just to protect Americans at home but to protect U.S. troops in the field. “Our troops in the field depend on timely and reliable intelligence,” she said.

Let me get this straight: If the phone companies have to defend themselves in court when they break the law, American troops will be in danger, right? The level of stupidity is jaw-dropping. American troops are in danger, Speaker Pelosi, because you lied when you said you would try to end the war and bring them home. As the record shows, the Congress has not done a god damned thing to stop the war, nor are they going to. Instead, you give the Sadist-In-Chief MORE money than he asks for, MORE police state powers than he asks for, and immunity from civil and criminal law for his thugs.

I do a point-by-point rebuttal on my page, for anyone who's interested.

I'd like to see bloggers compile a "Shit List" of politicians who support this abomination of a bill, so people can remember and seek retribution through primary challenges against these tossers.