Prove your statement. The United States entered into a foreign country under a pretext that was found to be false. We were wrong to invade Iraq. Now, we are mired in a war that was inevitable if you know your history of this region of the world. We also have weakened our military in the process and not just in the short-term, but for many years to come. Contrary to the Bush skein of lies, the surge has not worked. This, BTW, should be an obvious point since recent events have proven that we, with more than 130,000 American troops, cannot quell violence in major regions in Iraq.

Both Clinton and Obama are correct on removing troops from Iraq. The only problem I have with Clinton is that I think she's not above pandering to the Right, making some deal down the road, to keep our troops in Iraq if it suits a political purpose for her.

Over the past 20 yrs, PA has become less conservative, especially on the economy. Now having lived in the state, I know very well the mindset of many in the state and it's not favorable to Obama. However, this state is also fed up with the Bush economic policies and most understand that McCain will not help them. Many will vote for Obama simply because they can't face another 4 years of a Bush-lite presidency. There's give there in the numbers.

The one impressive sign is that there is an enormous upsurge in Dem voters from the 2004 primary. It's blowing away previous tallies. That is clearly good for both Obama or Clinton depending on which gets the nomination in the end.

He also is running against a former First Lady and Senator. Most people didn't know Obama's name a year ago or even several months ago. I would love to know how Clinton sees herself as a winning nominee when she has done nothing but lost ground for several months.

because PA is filled with people who won't vote for the black guy. This state has changed a lot but not enough apparently. I have higher hopes for Indiana and NC.

I have to admit it though. As poor a candidate as Clinton is, she has been able to muster the uneducated white, yet disaffected vote well. I have no idea where that leaves the Democratic party since this is no longer our true base. This situation is amazing to me since this is the type of issue I tossed at the Repubs months ago as McCain/Romney/Huckabee shredded traditional coalitions. Now, it's apparent that this is true for the Democratic Party.

Given the levels of dissatisfaction for both Obama and Clinton, I question now if a Democrat can win in November. I know I won't cast a vote for McCain but I doubt I'll do it for Hillary, if she ends up the nominee. I really don't believe that she reflects the values of the Democratic Party. Not the Party I want to vote for anyway. Her recent pandering to gun rights groups and the comments about Iran have pushed me over the edge. I don't even know if she's serious with this type of talk. All I know is that I don't want to be a part of that.

Only in a pipe dream does anyone give Hillary a boost going forward. Her negatives are now bigger than ever. She's just above broke now with 2 weeks to go before another election and she faces a big loss in NC. The only caveat is that Obama's negatives are higher too.

That's it basically. Good luck going forward Hillary. If by any miracle Hillary makes it to the GE, she hasn't a prayer. She has turned off more progressive Dem voters and we represent the reliable base.

Don't you see that the only sure way to win an election is to maintain and grow your base? For some reason, you think that's white, uneduated people. That's not true for the Democratic Party. It hasn't been for a long time. These are the same people who voted for Bush, Bush and Reagan. The only reason some of these people voted for Hillary is that they are now truly desperate and need someone to bail them out. Will they be with her in November? Don't bank on it. McCain can still win these people. They actually like this guy.

The Democratic Party has for too long tried to play with Republican rules, a loser of a game. Obama has done the smart thing by pulling in so many voters who are 1) committed to progressive ideas 2) new voters and 3) young voters. In a state like PA, this is a hard sell and Obama did very well with the demographics he has. He doesn't need them i a GE tohugh. He can win without them.

Hillary, OTOH, played right into all the old stereotypes and fear-mongering that has worked well for Republicans against Dems. Great job Hillary. Now how many progressive Dems and new voters will vote for you in November? That's the problem. You turn off your most reliable voters you get left with a loser of a GE strategy. I think the Clinton camp believes that people will just turn to her because they have nothing else left. What a great way to boost a Nader candidacy.

You wrote:

"About those voters

The white uneducated voters that keep Obama from "closing the deal" and Clinton in the race, are also called Reagan Democrats. They have been voting the GOP ticket in every presidential election since 1980. Despite their almost hopeless employment situation in an outsourced US economy, they vote in the general on issues like abortion, gay marriage, gun ownership, flag burning and other phony "patriotic" issues. They will vote for McCain regardless of who the Democrats run against him.

-- pantanal "

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Isn't it funny how people so conveniently forget this fact? Most of the people who would NEVER vote for Barack Obama, will probably not vote for Hillary either against McCain. They certainly voted for Bush.