Thanks Readerreader for your thoughts about how to honestly reckon with debt. I appreciate that you won't go to a Tea Party, because it does seem a bit unhinged.

I do have to ask, since you read Salon: How do you reply to Glenn Greenwald's post today about the right wing freak out about the DHS report? I have to say I'm not crazy about that news -- I hate any hint of domestic spying -- but I couldn't EVER get to the report today, the site was busy all 20 times I tried. It does kill me to think Michelle Malkin and other ignorant people are foaming at the mouth at this news, when they did nothing when the Bush administration was clearly targeting domestic resistance, at the various Republican conventions and elsewhere.

I mean, isn't there some bipartisan alliance of people who care about government spying? Glenn's part of it -- there isn't a single conservative who criticized Bush the way Glenn criticized Obama, on civil liberties etc. We need more integrity in our politics and political reporting. Will you join us, Readerreader?

Thanks, John762. If you're not curious about what I saw, then don't read it. I'd find something interesting at a Sarah Palin rally, too. That's what I do for a living; I'm not interested in merely having my prejudices confirmed. But to each his own.

Thanks, Abstract Badger, honey! That was thoroughgoing!

Aaargh, Christina, fixing now. I misread my own handwriting -- CD...something -- and betrayed my own economic ignorance. Thanks for being there, I respect what you're trying to do!

Ah, reallynow, you're cute. I confessed my economic ignorance; you displayed yours. I had a long day doing actual work that I sign my real name to; got a fact wrong; corrected it. Good luck with whatever it is you do.

Stay classy, billjenks!

Wow. What a thread. plutark, thanks for hanging in there -- I guess I disagree on one thing: I think the Internet is helping improve discourse, as we get the hang of it. The discussion in this letters thread is fascinating, with a few exceptions. virtue001 isn't my cup of tea, so to speak, but he's found ways to get along with Faulkner Jr. (who is much more patient than I am.) Readerreader comes back for more. And a year ago, XH was doing to ME what he's now doing to my critics (that's a longer story; we really agreed the whole time, he just didn't see it!)

Anyway, thanks for being there -- yesterday, and today. And you should check out Open Salon if you haven't already, you would really find a following.

Omar Effendi, I think r1chard3 was saying that because we punished the Japanese for waterboarding American prisoners, at one time we clearly considered it torture and illegal. I did not get from that he was defending executing Japanese -- if we did execute people, I haven't Googled that, I only know that we held it was illegal torture at the time...

You know, Brian Stegner, I actually think about those questions every day, so I'm fine with your asking them. I am obviously not as down on Obama as you are -- although it takes a lot of self discipline every day not to remind former Obamabots of their lefty delusions about him from a year ago, which I never shared. (Please, XH, don't change sides now!)

I think what Obama is up against is even worse than we know. The fact that Leon Panetta changed sides immediately upon taking the helm at CIA? I totally agree with you about his selling out to Wall Street. But...on balance, I think I'm doing the best I can by accepting invitations to stand up for the rule of law, and call out anti-American felons like Liddy. But I really do think about whether I'm playing the role of clown in some kind of ugly Bread and Circus diversion. So far, I'd say no. But you can disagree.

Absolutely, Omar Effendi. Absolutely. No one is saying that's only a movie. People should be prosecuted.

What are you all thinking? Impeach Judge Jay Bybee? Or is that a distraction from a mass call for prosecutions? I can't decide, personally. I do know I believe there should be prosecutions.

Yes, XH, I'll forget you asked if you forget I made that obnoxious point...but I couldn't help it.

Seriously, though, I have had arguments with friends who were absolute Hillary supporters (but who voted for Obama) who say she'd have been tougher on Wall Street and better on torture/state secrets, and I say to them: I don't believe it. I never saw any difference between them politically, only stylistically, and therefore I assume they'd have had roughly the same policies this far in.

I do believe that makes me better prepared to be clear-eyed about Obama's flaws than some people -- but not you!

The Unlovely Truth, please don't waste your time, in the future, trying to pretend you're interested in dialogue here. Because that's not what OE said, and even more important, that's not what anyone's trying to debate.

I did catch some of your earlier posts in other threads trying to say you were open to dialogue, and I really appreciate that. But with a post like that, you undermine your premise.