'the entire town could more or less wash their hands of their responsibility in this mess.'

That seems to be the name of the game at the moment, which proves to me that no one is really prepared to do anything meaningful about this problem at the levels required to reverse it.

Right now it seems to be all about MORAL responsibility, and how to get out of it, or feel better than one's neighbour, or shift it etc etc etc. All of which means zip, anyway. I don't think the earth cares about our moral responsibility. And history will tar us all with the same brush anyway.

I wish people would quit trying to take the high moral ground on all this. All the plastic bags in China are not going to make a difference if we can't get our act together on this. And we can't. Just the posts above prove that. And it isn't going to change. There are holocaust deniers in our midst RIGHT NOW. This proves to me there will be people denying global warming when the rainforests are deserts and we're all living underground.

Anyway. If people - any people - were really that worried we would be seeing a drop in reproduction for example. Or peopel moving away from the coasts. Neither of which is happening. During the Great Depression the birth rate fell dramatically. When steps like having fewer children are taken then maybe we'll be on the right track. Until then it's just a competition to see Who is More Holy, and the people who annoy me the most in this area are the movie stars. If I have to read one more time about Brad Pitt encouraging everyone to lessen their consumption while he takes another helicopter to another dinner party I'll ... well, I'll smirk! There! That's useful!

Finally, the planet may well cool down as response to global warming. This is because as sea temperatures rise the composition of the gulf stream may be affected and it may stop flowing. Thereby pitching Europe back into the ice age.

The only way for a woman to go uncriticised is to focus on hair and make up, stare adoringly at her husband at all times and cultivate lots of other wives of powerful men who do the same.

That way women will be unthreatened and they'll oooh and aaah over your hats and White House do-overs. Men will respect the candidate because he knows how to keep a woman in her rightful place, and the media will love her because she keeps her moutuh shut so they can project whatever their fantasy of the day is all over her.

WHEN IS THIS GOING TO STOP? Michelle is copping it in the neck because the woman in any equation always does. Hillary has been dealt with, now it's on to Michelle. Barack will get his turn but there's a fundamental problem with all male candidates for those who would seek to bring them down: they have a dick and therefore they are entitled to rule. They are entitled to have a voice. They are entitled to be heard. Not so for women.

I read a NYer article recently about Michelle Obama and it was exactly the same - why is she complaining? Why is she obsessed her daughters and the opportunities they will have? Why is she angry? I was amazed at the naivete of the magazine.

I relate to Hillary and Michelle and I'm not even American. I'm a woman, and I am nearly 40 now, and I am so so so tired of pretending not to be powerful in order that people around me can feel comfortable. The more comfortable women become with ttheir own power hte more comfortable they will be other women's. I don't know what it's goign to take for men to be comfortable with powerful women, though. I really don't.

Q: What does this have to do with Hillary Clinton?

A: Michelle Obama, as well as being black, is a woman.

Right there you have two HUGE red circles painted on her butt saying 'kick me'. Listen out for criticism of her: hair, ageing, parenting, weight, appearance, fashion choices, voice, stridency, shrillness. Listen out for Barack being portrayed as: henpecked, weak, a puppet. These are clues that sexism as well as racism is in the mix.

Weeping: I think you may be misconstruing Joan's comments there as support for your point of view. I didn't read it that way. I thought she was politely asking you to keep it civil.

Mr.EdCt: despite all that, you could STILL be a racist you know. Racism is not about pedigree, it's about what your attitudes are. And when people talk about being victims of racism they are not necessarily talking about YOU. They are talking about a phenomenon, not a person. Yes, some victims of racism are also racist. Some people do tar all white people with the same brush. More fool them. They themselves are racist when they do that. White racism, however, as a phenomenon, exists. That is what they are talking about.