Tyler_Mason, I'm going to assume (against all logic) that you seriously advocate allowing college students to keep guns in their dorm rooms, in the belief it would make them safer in some real way.

Let's see now, hmmm, what things do we stereotypically associate with the phrase "college students" these days? Several words pop up right away: "party", "alcohol" and "drugs".

Oh yes, by ALL means, let's see what we can do to bring guns into situations that are far too often soaked in booze and other drugs, both legal and illegal. (And NO, I realize all students don't party hardy all the time -- but the stereotype DOES have a significant basis in reality.)

I bet you're also in favor of another grand idea: Storing cans of gasoline beside open flames.

...on my comment about firearms, Xanthro -- my comment was predicated on what DID happen today, as well as what HAS happened in the past, not on what is theoretically possible.

The details are lacking on exactly what happened today, including what weaponry the killer used. However, I for one do not know of a case where a deranged killer committed an arson of similar magnitude. Does anyone have any such examples?

I should have been more careful with my wording, in any case -- my point was that it's hard to conceive of any easier or more effective way to murder large numbers of people than with firearms, as was apparently the case today.

Sure, if a large building is torched, large numbers COULD die, but those inside the building aren't exactly being held at gunpoint, waiting to be executed. They can, and will, try to escape. Any deaths would be equally horrific, of course.

Then you have the case of large bombs, such as what took down the federal building in Oklahoma City -- but then, bombs aren't covered by 2nd Amendment rights, I *assume*.

...but I'll carry on anyway.

My obvious question, T_M, was precisely whether you'd encourage the general storage of gasoline cans near open flames, especially near people who aren't, shall we say, under control themselves. The analogy to your "modest proposal" to arm dorm residents should be apparent.

I have limited sympathy for people who do dumb things that come back to bite only themselves in the butt. My son refers to this as Darwin Award material -- and I generally agree.

I see guns + college students + dorms as a risky situation that's far more likely to be disastrous for others than it is to be beneficial for themselves. That's all I meant, which I thought was obvious.

No doubt I'm boring others -- I'm boring myself with so many items.

To answer my own question about mass murder by arson, a drunken Julio Gonzalez torched the Happy Land night club in the Bronx in 1990, in an apparent attempt to kill his former girlfriend -- causing the deaths of 87 people, which is considered a record death toll for arson.

Done "right", no doubt arson can cause equal or greater carnage than firearms. Point taken, xanthro.

You must not have seen my (allegedly) last item posted about 90 minutes before your last item so far.

Yes, as my previous item indicated, the Happy Land arson (which I'd heard of at the time, but had forgotten -- possibly because I don't live near New York) WAS a horrendous mass murder -- reportedly the worst arson in history. It only took a quick Wikipedia search to refresh my memory about it.

I'm not going to try to debate what the most efficient or prolific means for murder is -- you may be completely right that arson is the "winner."

But I also know that we can never get the firearm genie back in the bottle, now that the U.S. is flooded with weaponry of all kinds. Now the question is, how do we deal with that flood and all of its consequences? Some think the relatively easy availability of weapons here is no problem -- that it's actually a GOOD thing.

Don't think I will ever get to that point. But another writer chastised everyone for jumping to conclusions before all the pertinent details of the Va. Tech incident are known -- very good advice. We SHOULD hold off until that judgment can be a truly informed one.