I was referring to modern "liberals" that are not "liberal" at all. I have deep respect for the position of the classic liberal like some of the founders that you mention. In fact, the word libertarian is often used to mean "classic liberal".

You know the "modern liberals" that I referred to in my post. They are the ones that claim that unequal outcomes mean that the field was not level in the first place and something must be done as if egalitarianism is the be all, end all of human life.

I have studied Austrian Economics (as in von Mises) for 30 years and I can tell you that smear jobs like Holly claiming that we are all "selfish" is bullshit. The truth is that unemployment is impossible without government intervention. I'll sum up the reasons why someday when I get time and Glenn posts on the economy.

Until then, you know that there are ass-hats that ruin the word "liberal" just as there are ass-hats that ruin the word "libertarian". (think Glenn Beck)

In many regards the confusion Glenn writes about can said to come from vastly different views on economics. The thread is positively littered with letters mentioning economics either explicitly or implicitly.

So, let us listen to a retired professor of finance who is predicting the future.

http://www.lewrockwell.com/rozeff/rozeff313.html (or sig)

A teaser:

My bet is this. One fine day the bottom is going to drop out of the dollar. There will be a swift and sharp order of magnitude change. The recognition of the problems will reach a point at which it starts to go exponential, not just in terms of people being vaguely conscious that things are not right, but in terms of actually taking action to protect themselves. Foreign central banks may be reluctant to dump their dollar securities and think it better to liquidate them slowly so as not to drive prices down and break the market, but when they observe that others are running for the exits, they will run too. There will be a run on the FED and a run on the U.S. government.

In effect, he is predicting hyper-inflation.

As a little perspective, let us look at one of the many, many examples of hyper-inflation from the past. I pick the past because when I tried to use Zimbabwe here so many felt that we would never fall into the same circumstances as that of a backward place like that might go through. So, let us pick the Germans.

In 1914 a pound of butter cost 1.4 marks. In 1918 a pound of butter cost 3.0 marks. In 1922 a pound of butter cost 2,400 marks. In 1923 a pound of butter cost 6,000,000,000,000 marks.

Don't care for butter? How about an egg? In 1914 it cost less than one mark and nine years later it cost eighty billion marks. 80,000,000,000 which means that was one damn fine egg; or that the mark was nearly worthless --- an exercise in thought left up to the student.

We are headed to the dream world of the so-called modern liberal. Everyone will be the same --- utterly devastated. (except for those damn gold-bug fellows perhaps)

Yes, to the shame of the American RC Church.

It may be true that Sinnard tortures babies at tailgate parties on football weekends; but that does not stop what Edwards did from being a horrible thing. Why don't you go ask a hundred women if they would excuse their hubby for actions like those of Edward's actions.

And those three have sock-puppets to insult Dennis Kucinich and should be banned also under the rr theory.

=:-)

At Rockwell's blob he wrote:

Sunshine Libertarians

Posted by Lew Rockwell on September 22, 2009 12:16 PM

Tom Delay was a warmonger and socialist when Bush was in power, and a sorta-libertarian under Clinton. (Now he’s on Dancing With the Stars.) Glenn Beck was among the most commissar-like of the neocons under Bush — he even compared Ron Paul donors to terrorists. Now, under Obama, Beck claims to be a libertarian. But could he be trusted to stand for freedom were Romney, say, Despot 45? Forgive me for having my doubts. (Thanks to Dennis Marburger)

UPDATE I had forgotten that Beck hosted Comrade David Horowitz on this same show to charge in the best Soviet fashion that LRC is allied to “Islamofascists.”

All in all, a very good post today Greenwald. I would quibble a bit here and there; but it is an A+ post.

Unfortunately, all groups have to put up with people using their "label" even though they are not of that group. For example, Glenn Beck is no libertarian and that is the fact.

Are you making all this up as you go along?

As long as government does not step in to aid the business nor the union; there is no problem at all with collective bargaining. We believe in voluntary cooperation. You may smoke hash or join a union; as long as you don't use government thugs to give you advantage. (I have done at least one of those, maybe both)

Click on sig for the utube.

I think Kinison is the archetypal war-hawk in this clip. Funny as hell.

... why not in all things?

http://www.examiner.com/x-536-Civil-Liberties-Examiner~y2009m9d18-At-least-with-traffic-fewer-rules-make-for-better-behavior?cid=examiner-email

There's a concept called "spontaneous order" popular among many philosophers and economists. (from article)

A Taoist concept dating, perhaps, back as far as four to five thousand years. A more exacting version might be "mutual arising". Anyway, Lao Tzu told us that the more rules; the worse the behavior.

Perhaps it is time for America to stop trying to enforce our rules on the world.

---
And here you did not think I could bring it back on-topic. Yea of little faith.

You get a hearty Amen on that one.