but, but, but, I thought that wasn't possible?

I thought patriotism, the more it purifies itself the more fervor you bring to it. My patriotism can't be perverted, it's patriotic.

What's a matter with you, you don't like patriotism?

I don't wanna say anything, but that's perverted!

I knew that Go Fuck Yourself (get it right, dammit) from Digby was my ticket to fame and fortune the second I saw it this morning. I'll be dining out on it for years. "Did I ever tell you about the time Digby told me... Oh. You have? Oh. You do?"

And then, I will leave, in a marked manner! They will know Derbig Mooser, DFH et al RSP, has been there, if they were paying attention. Sort of.

I've been more than compensated for being abused by Digby by the comments made here in response to my questions. Thanks to all.

Ya gotta make allowances over at Hullabaloo, they deal mostly in witty quips and conventional wisdom, with a lot of butt-sex, recipes, and pet stories for filler. Or maybe I'm thinking of Eschaton. I get mixed up.

my friend, if you do have occasion to tell me to Go Fuck Myself, I will. You may depend upon it, I will!

Shit! I mean wear it as a badge of honor, damnit, it's the badge of honor thing. I didn't mean... Oh crap, why do I even try? I couldn't bake a fresh bon mot or even find the mot juste if my life depended upon it.

But I would take you out to eat, if I could,

That's what my dad said every time I cracked a joke (or tried to) as a young kid: I would say "Dad, do you get it" and he'd say "Oy, I get it. It's strictly from hunger"!

Did I tell you what he said when I told him I wanted a new Jaguar XKE?

And soldiers will follow orders, Mooser

And that leads me to something that's always fascinated me. Sure, most of them follow orders, but at the highest levels they formulate policy and orders in conjunction with the reigning administration, right? And they have no obligation when, for instance, a President says: "Go in there boys, and bomb those people till they love us, and then I wanna see those films, like in France, kissin and huggin or liberatin' boys"

So all that integrity and service and patriotism and bravery keeps them from saying: "Well, respectfully sir, we can't actually do that.We can provide you with a horrendously tragic and expensive fuck-up, if you's rather, but we can't do that bombs-to-love thing so good anymore"

Especially when the war you are going to fight is supposed to be a war of policy! Policy, even if your policy is war, is supposed to be something you can sustain, or do in different places at the same time, without straining your other resouces. We may to pre-empt a bunch of different little Hitlers, you know, and if even one gets the idea we're not serious...

So what happened. Patriotism means you can't say no, and mean it? Or does patriotism mean they say yes.

He and 15 of his comrades took off their uniforms, kept their government-issued rifles and went over to the other side without a second thought

This is beyond the frozen limit! I paid for that damn rifle! Does he think the uniform makes up for it? Hey, you, you , you Iraqi, come back here with that rifle!

The man is a theif!

Policy is formulated by civilians and carried out by the military.

Yeah, I see where I'm sort of mixed up about it. It's just so hard to grasp how it could possibly come about, when even the most cursory review could tell you what was the most likely result in an expedition of this type, and what the costs would be. But if, in the process, a tremendous amount of care is taken, I suppose any considerations of fact, legality, success could be successfully eliminated from consideration.

Apparently, prior to that time, we had called up an army as needed...

Saw a very interesting article at Lew Rockwell or whatever. The guy was talking about how G Washington came to valley forge and found an Army which had become a sort of democratic Guerilla army. Ranks were not separated to a great extent, and strategy and tactics were reached in consensus with the men.

And it was a sucessful Army.

So Washington tore into it, and re-organised along, I believe Prussian lines, with some hired Teutonic help. And when the winter was over, the Army was drilling and martineting just like a European Army. And you take a lot more casualties that way, too, as opposed to harassment and rear-attack and what not. So the men were totally fucking miserable, felt like slaves, and we went on to win the Revolutionary War.

Me, I feel for those guys, who felt themselves democratic guerilla fighters and ended up as virtual slaves. But Wow! what if Washington hadn't done this?

Geez, that was wrenching. Like a punch in the stomach.

shock and awe would work.

And it did.

Correct me if I'm mistaken, but didn't we have about half of Iraq as a "no fly" zone? And weren't there years of sanctions? And didn't we leaflet the Iraqis long before the invasion advising them to surrender and threatening consequences (is that and act of war?). And hadn't the Iraqi war with Iran been pretty draining on the Iraqis.

They had no Air Force whatsoever, and no Navy, am I right? Not in any terms worth noticing, right?

And in any case, Saddam's hold on power was, at that point, tenuous, and by the time we invaded, he had offered to abdicate and leave? I think I remember that. That'll sort of send any leadership you have into the crapper, no?

But somehow, praise the lord and pass the ammunition, shock and awe worked. It's a miracle.