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aVulcan

Published Letters: 274

Monday, January 26, 2009 05:16 PM
Original article: Obama's Hamas problem

@Evil MinPin - Did you read the hate leaflet the Israeli Army chief rabbinate gave to the troops before they went into Gaza?

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/middle-east/army-rabbi-gave-out-hate-leaflet-to-troops-1516805.html

No wonder they didn't have an issue with the murder of Palestinian civilians and the wholesale destruction of Gaza. The funny thing is how the Israeli spin machine always accuses the Palestinians of being full of hate! Could it be the Israelis are projecting when they do that?

Tuesday, January 27, 2009 02:02 PM

This analysis misses the following...

1) Israel has a deliberate policy of inflicting pain on civilians to achieve political aims, or in the words of the former Israel Defense Forces chief of staff Moshe Yaalon:

The Palestinians must be made to understand in the deepest recesses of their consciousness that they are a defeated people. The use of weapons, like white phosphorous, that burn the soft tissues and the flesh, should be viewed in this context. The 2-year siege of Gaza is another manifestation of these policies.

2) There are specific instances where the International Red Cross was prevented for reaching the wounded. In one case, they were prevented for 4 days from reaching an area where children were left to starve next to the dead bodies of their mothers. http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2009/jan/08/gaza-israel-palestinian-territories

Obviously, the author is trying to whitewash the Israeli war crimes. Israel has been very careful not to allow foreign journalists in during the fighting so they wouldn't be able to document the war crimes. Hopefully there is enough evidence left to convict the war criminals.

Tuesday, January 27, 2009 05:29 PM

There is no doubt Israel committed war crimes on a massive scale

With hundreds of children burned with white phosphorus shells (a chemical which burns through the skin and the soft tissues all the way to the bone causing unimaginable pain), fired by one of the most heavily armed armies in the world against a defenseless population in one of the most densely populated areas in the world, only a lawyer for Israel (or a propagandist) can be asking if war crimes were committed!

Wednesday, January 28, 2009 01:25 AM

@palestrajon and Child Casualties in Gaza

Here is an example of the use of white phosphorus on a 13-year old child in Gaza

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/video/2009/jan/19/gaza-phosphorus-victim

Here are more examples:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/7848768.stm

Here are the stories of some of the children murdered by Israel's army in Gaza (you must be very proud)

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2009/jan/23/gaza-children-casualties-israeli-attacks

Here is more info on the illegal use of weapons.

Human Rights Watch has accused Israel of illegally firing white phosphorous, which causes horrific burns if it comes in contact with the skin, over crowded refugee camps in Gaza. Medics and human rights groups are also reporting that they are seeing injuries distinctive of another controversial weapon, Dense Inert Metal Explosive, known as DIME, that was designed by the US Air Force in 2006. Those struck by the weapon who survive suffer severe mutilations and internal injuries.

- http://www.democracynow.org/2009/1/14/white_phosphorous_and_dense_inert_metal

Wednesday, January 28, 2009 05:43 AM

@palestrajon and Child Casualties in Gaza

The facts I provided in my latest links are not "anecdotal" (did you not for example see the video of the white phosphorous victim). I realize that for Israel apologists/propagandists, it is important to dismiss Palestinian civilian casualties, but the evidence is overwhelming.

Consider the following, as reported by the UN:

1,314 people had been killed, including 416 children and 106 women; and 5,320 people had been injured, including 1,855 children and 795 women.

http://domino.un.org/UNISPAL.NSF/f45643a78fcba719852560f6005987ad/1cdd241153ed6c6285257544004fe09f!OpenDocument

These grim statistics add up to 2,271 children killed or maimed by the Israeli army. Given the wide use of white phosphorous, and the reports from the reporters who were allowed in after the assault ended (keep in mind the press were prevented by Israel from going in so that they wouldn't document the war crimes taking place during the attack) many of these victims were burned by white phosphorous.

I would like to know what your reaction would have been had 2,271 Jewish children been killed or maimed. I think I know the kind of words you would be using (but then you probably think of Palestinians as sub-humans anyway so this analogy wouldn't hold as far as you are concerned!)

Wednesday, January 28, 2009 08:20 AM

@PalestraJon and Justifying War Crimes

The UN, which has a strong presence on the ground through UNRWA and others, quoting Palestinian health sources, is as reliable a source as it gets. Note that Israel didn't allow journalists in to witness the war crimes. This was another one of their "brilliant" hasbara (propaganda) moves which I am sure you approve of as daily reporting of Palestinian civilians burned with white phosphorous might have proven inconvenient. However, the journalists who made it into Gaza after the end of the assault, confirmed the scope of destruction and the massive use of lethal force in dense civilian areas (keep in mind that people in the concentration camp we call Gaza had nowhere to go to escape the assault).

You are indeed a racist. Otherwise you wouldn't be doing moral gymnastics to try to justify the unjustifiable; Israel's murder and maiming of thousands of Palestinian civilians, including 2,271 children. Again, I ask you to reflect on how you would react if these were Jewish children murdered and maimed by Palestinians? Only if you were able to do so would I believe that you are not a racist.

The fact of the matter is I think the approach of people like you - who can be always relied upon to whitewash Israel's atrocities and justify its illegal actions - is why we don't have peace in the Middle East. I am for security for both Israel and the Palestinians (who certainly need it far more). I don't like what Hamas does but the fact is that the Palestinian president never said that "Hamas started this war precisely to reap PR advantage from civilian casualties" as you claim (what are your sources?). Regardless, Hamas' war crimes of firing ineffective missiles at Israel (which killed 20 people in 8 years) pale in comparison to those of Israel. At the end, one does not justify the other no matter how hard you try.

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