You and others are missing my point: We can talk about race if Obama becomes the nominee -- as a Clinton supporter I am willing to acknowledge that looks likely -- or we can put a Democrat in the White House. I don't really think we can do both.

In my case, I think you are placing too much faith in my powers of deduction. I thought you were going in a totally different direction. The current point above is legitimate, and one to be mulled over at length. Another point would be that if Hillary is nominated we will inevitably talk about sexism instead. Something that a lot of posters here feel as entrenched or more so than racism. The democratic party has already decided they didn't want the "safe white male" candidates. None of them got any traction except for Edwards, who only got a little. Maybe we the people are up to something, even if we don't know quite what it is yet.

Hillary is not running as a feminist candidate.

And Obama is not running as a black candidate either. Saying that Obama supporters really wanted to talk about race all along is a bit much. I suspect most were whistling past the graveyard, like doomed extras in a Wes Craven flick.

I'll recast my point again: The dems didn't choose any of the "safe white male" candidates, and there were many of them. Instead they chose Hillary and Obama. So we were going to get these "conversations" (a very generous characterization, I know) about race and/or sexism, guaranteed. Now, and in the general. If one's sole motive is to avoid the race conversation then go ahead and choose Hillary. Be prepared though to trade the race conversation for the sexist conversation. Either candidate will have to fight through the mud to win in November. It's still a judgement call as to which candidate has the best chance to survive the mudslinging.

Personally, I wouldn't mind talking about something else for a bit. Like say Iraq. This issue will keep. Is Bill Mahr right and the neo-con definition of success in Iraq, is staying a 100 years? Is McCain/Libermann/Bush really trying to start a war with Iran?

The dems are pretty good about beating the crap out of each other. Against the republicans, not so much.

No worries. You don't strike me as one of the more trollish posters, so you still have plenty of cred.

I apologize if I over-reacted to your post. Your calling for Joan to write about other issues and stay away from Obama fell right in the middle of a bunch of nasty posts calling for her to step down or take a vacation. I guess I was reacting more to them. Sorry.

why weep for a shieldmaiden and valkyrie? I'm always one for myth and metaphor

And conflict each other:

Gallup: Obama recaptures edge over Clinton

Gallup reports: Barack Obama has quickly made up the deficit he faced with Hillary Clinton earlier this week, with the latest Gallup Poll Daily tracking update on Democratic presidential nomination preferences showing 48% of Democratic voters favoring Obama and 45% Clinton.

http://blogs.usatoday.com/onpolitics/2008/03/gallup-obama-re.html

Ramussen

Nationally, Hillary Clinton now holds a very slight advantage over Barack Obama, 46% to 44%.

http://www.rasmussenreports.com/public_content/politics/election_20082/2008_presidential_election/daily_presidential_tracking_poll

Fester is an admonition not to take myself or others too seriously. Plus I envy his talent for self-illumination, a quality we should all seek.

Self Portrait: http://mythicaldude.typepad.com/mythicaldude/images/eatlight.jpg

Brunnhilde invokes the image of some brooding literary type. Usually the only thing we get on the internets from lore like the Elder Edda is trolls. So color me curious...

Have you ever listened to or seen Wagner's opera?

I've only heard the flight of the Valkyries by Wagner, but I know the Ring stories upon which it is based (Völsunga saga). I'm still learning how to relate to Opera.

I like Norse mythology, but find it brooding, gloomy and melancholy. Life is tough with trickster gods like Odin and Loki.

While it may be true that the media and the Salon sub-universe of same is not helpful, they are only a reflection of ourselves and the people as a whole. Some of you may resent this sewer analogy, so perhaps your posts are the exception, lotus jewels of wisdom floating above the muck, unbesmirched. Despite some foul odor, I'm generally impressed with what I'm reading. As much as you can trust anything read on the internets, I'm hearing what sounds like real life stories.

Morally, is this good, bad, or even helpful? I don't know. But at least it's different. Some of us don't want to deal with this, Others think it's a matter of timing, and don't want to deal with it now. And I think quite a few are hoping for some act of sublimation where we transmute in a flash all the evil nasty gunk and just get beyond it.

I think we have to start we were are, warts and all. And I don't know of a better way to see the humanity in us all other than to start sharing our stories of who we are and what we have seen. My 0.02 euro.