As for you, shooter, you make my case for me better than I could make it myself. No one here is fooled by your solicitation toward Jews; to you they're just a convenient talking point. In another age, the man who refers frequently to islamofascists and hezbos would be equally pleased with himself to speak of commies or kikes. --William Timberman

Oh brother, LOL. How absurd. You're going to equate disdain for mass murderers or sneak attackers of Israel as a predeliction for racist slurs? How bizarre. Quit while you're behind.

There is no need for you to prove that Bush isn't kidnapping people, Shooter. He's already admitted to doing that and he's already stated that he will continue to do so, based solely upon his judgement.

Sorry bud, you're going to have to show me that verbiage in reflection of current law. "Because I said so" isn't going to fly.

Unless every person in this country (legally or not - citizen or not) receives the benefit(s) of our constitution, said constitution is rather worthless, wouldn't you say?-- Jebbie

Then it would seem that to you, there is no such thing as an illegal alien. Then what would the purpose of borders? As with most things given away for free, citizenship would become worthless. Is that what you had in mind?

Empty attitudes, empty noises and a sneer. Hard to find an actual human being under all that belligerent greasepaint....-- William Timberman

Looks like I'm going to have to relegate you to leftwing troll status. Tsk.

Today you have truly presented a glowing testiment to your, I don't know, think of some really bad human quality.--Anonymous

Like liberalness? If you people didn't have something to complain about you'd shrivel up and blow away. But finally, someone asks a question rather than just attack. Let's see what happens.....

YOUR Habeus rights exist only if the president says they do. Gonzo inferred this during testimony to Congress, this indeed happened to Padilla, Bush admitted to spiriting people away based only on his descretion, and yet you still refuse to acknowledge this. Hiding behind the irrelevant argument, "See everyone - Habeus does exist. Don't panic."

And I stand by that sentiment. There is no need to panic.

Here's why. I think everyone agrees to one degree or another that terrorism is real and that as a free society we aren't well equipped to head an additional 9/11 off at the pass. For the last six years our country has been engaged in a tug of war over what is the minimum restriction necessary to ensure a certain standard of security. It is the defining of those terms that we are arguing over, and it must be recognized that the argument is our way of debating and settling the issues.

The rapidity with which the legal situation changes, causes the problem of people arguing over issues that have already been settled. Even when the issue has been settled in their favor.

Sit down everyone. I absolutely agree that Padilla was denied his Habeas Corpus rights. (Take deep breath) Even Bush recognized he was on legal quicksand and demonstrated that when he changed Padilla's status and sent him to Miami for trial, before the Supremes could whack him for due process. No American citizen has been denied his Habeas rights since, nor will they, because to do so would directly go against the Supreme Court and the country wouldn't stand for it. Bitching and moaning about how terrible Padilla's plight was, is a non-starter. It's been fixed. And you people are going to have to keep up with events.

The same has been done with Al Maari and the cementing of Habeas for resident aliens. That leaves us with non-resident aliens and what rights they have. Hamden addresses those via the Geneva Convention, but there are contradictions in what covers who and when. The complaints about Habeas, rendition, and incommunicado detainment are all in relation to overseas prisoners, not people here in the states. I understand why people are upset about CIA treatment of prisoners, but Bush has modified his stance several times and will likely continue to do so.

The problem I have is the conflation of domestic policy with CIA policy overseas. They are not the same and should not be presented as such. I'm not a lawyer and things happen around this issue with such speed and complexity, it's hard to keep track of what's what. That's why I said I was open to other information. But one would think you folks would be knowledgable about the successes the left have won. Apparently not, and "the sky is falling" because "I said so", is just dumb ignorance.

The country is on a learning curve of adjusting expectations and concerns with remaining a Constitutional Government, and the constantly swinging pendulum between security and freedom reassures me all is well. It is in fact the passion evidenced here that is the basis for that confidence. However... people that throw out ignorant assertions in troll-like fashion to me, that are ill disguised attempts to muddy the water or just start a fight, will get one. It's all up to you. Especially in Mona's case.