If Canada (or Mexico) controlled our electricity and gasoline supplies, and some Patriots or Minutemen or Molly Pitchers or whatever the fuck were lobbing crude rockets over the border, would you feel that the collective punishment of the rest of us would be a little, I dunno, harsh?-- Valentinian

That would require that the entire US was collaborating with the bombers.

Does it not occur to you that it would never get to that point, because we would have tracked down the bombers ourselves and either extradited or prosecuted them? The Palestinian people know who shoots rockets. The Israelis don't. If the Palestinians want to enable the firing of rockets, they can. But it has a price that goes with it. It is completely their choice.

Which brings up the next question... why in God's name are you people condoning the bombing of Israeli civilians? Aren't you people the same ones condemning Bush and Cheney on the same charge?

You'd get a lot further with your arguments if you didn't spew crap like this. Being against cutting off food and power is not to be in favor of bombing. You're not so stupid as to not realize that. You are therefore a liar. Imagine my surprise. -- Paul Dirks

Oh please, how can an opinion be a false statement of fact? That would make you the liar instead.

Meanwhile, back at the bombing I see nothing concrete from you or the others about how to forestall the bombing of civilians by Palestinians. That tells me you folks are OK with the status quo, that is to say, bombing innocent civilians. You may not be in FAVOR of bombing but you're content to let it continue. I believe that's called enabling.

Shooter - I said it yesterday and I'll say it again.... all this drama would stop in an instant if Islamic militants would accept Israel and each other.

El Cid - Wow, that, that is like, soooooo insightful.

Shooter - Then, they will have to die.
Are you sure you don't want to encourage the Palestinians to demonstrate something other than terminal belligerence? Israel has been in existence for some 60 years now, it isn't going away. One can choose between life and death. Maybe it's time to choose life for a change.

El Cid - After all, You've Got To Do Something, and since right wingers love idiotic solutions which make situations worse but at least have the merit of Doing Something, why not? -- El Cid

No, I was asking YOU personally to encourage the Palestinians to do something in the pursuit of life. Like not firing rockets at Israeli civilians.

And if there's no need to temper any moral declarations with any attempt at a reasoned inquiry into what things do and do not tend to work, why can't I simply demand that the Palestinians give up and go away, by screaming into a drinking glass in the back yard? Wouldn't that work?

Oh please, nobody has demanded the Palestinians go away, in fact, land has been returned. But they ARE going to have to give up the idea that Israel will go away. You're right that I have no control over the issue, only the Palestinians and Israelis do.

So I ask you, why not write that the Palestinians would be better off making peace, not war? Or do you prefer the years exhausted, and lives wasted, in pursuit of the "cause"? It certainly seems they do. But hey, if the Palestinians want to eschew a life of peace and prosperity, for the life of misery and poverty, than it's very likely it's what they'll get.

I appreciated the line...why can't I simply demand that the Palestinians give up and go away, by screaming into a drinking glass in the back yard? ". You make it sound like the injured feelings of the Palestinians are worth more than the lives of the Israelis. If that's true, they have no chance.

Try and understand, the vast majority of Palestinians want peace and prosperity, same as everyone else. They voted for Hammas, not because they share Hammas' utter hostility to Israel (most Palestinians accept Israel's existence), but because Fattah was so corrupt, whereas Hammas had for years been effectively providing basic services (schools, medicine, etc) for Palestinian society.

The Palestinians have always been in a very difficult situation, and making comments like "Why the hell don't they just do X" only shows an ignorance of this fact.-- paulpsd7

Nobody said anything was easy, but I can certainly amend my statement to ask.... Why won't the leadership of the Palestinians stop shooting rockets at Israel and accept their existence?

Granted, it's an oversimplistic question but it still reflects the essential problem. The Palestinians and fellow Islamists won't accept Israel. There may be all sorts of reasons for it, but at the end of the day it's a battle of wills. The Israelis want to survive, and the Islamists want them extinguished. So the real question comes down to whether the Islamists can ever defeat the Israeli's. They haven't after 60 years, and there is no reason to think they ever will.

Yet Palestinians are encouraged to fight on. By all of Islam and quite a few here. Is that in the Palestinians best interest? Of course not. But who cares, right? So I say to you and whoever else asks, rather than blame Israeli recalcitrance, address Palestinian petulance. How many more years of beating one's head against a wall are you willing to bear. The Israelis are fighting for their lives. For that, there is no time limit.